Silvestri Says – Wrapping Up Extended
Posted by Josh Silvestri
March 15, 2010 | 
17 comments
Hello readers! Just as in my Grand Prix Oakland article, today I'll mainly be focusing on the Extended decks I think are the best or close enough to be worth playing, with a few knocks on decks you shouldn't. After all, I got a bunch right the last time…
Dark Depths Thopter
There really isn't anything left to say about this deck; it's the undisputed best and everyone knows it at this point. Really the only question left is how metagamed your deck should be for the mirror and Zoo versus everything else in the field. Some people have adopted Damnation to take out Zoo decks*, while others have gone with the Jace, the Mind Sculptor plan to work on the mirror and other decks, and there's even some strange stuff you can see pop up on the MODO results page** from time to time. Just have some sort of a plan for those two decks and you can basically ride the innate power of the deck through almost every other match-up.
*Zoo can't really afford to play around it unless it has a nut draw, and it has so few ways of recovery, so one resolved Damnation buys far too much time.
**www.mtgonline.com for those who still haven't gotten the memo
To me it feels like this: You can figure out a trump to the mirror match on paper against one particular version of the deck, but odds are whatever edge you get isn't valid against all your Dark Depths opponents. Too many Depths players are on different trumps based on how much they kept up with the tech tree. First it was Meloku as an answer to the mirror, then Sower of Temptation, after which Sphinx of Jwar Isle was the big innovation. Who knows what it is now? Some people have been trying Jace, while others have fleshed out the Sphinx plan a bit more and others are simply not boarding out pieces of certain combos as the answers in the Depths sideboard become less about answering opposing combos, but instead trying to one-up each other in alternate win conditions. Figure out your plan and be ready to modify it in each and every match you come up with as both of the top decks have a bunch of variations nowadays.
Zoo
There are two main versions of Zoo right now and no, one of those isn't Big Zoo. The first of which is Fast Zoo, which by all accounts is the deck everyone is used to seeing. It includes one-drops, [card Knight of the reliquary]Knights[/card], Ranger of Eos and Tribal Flames (usually). Meanwhile the other version which has been catching on recently is the Naya version featuring Bloodbraid Elf and [card boom]Boom/Bust[/card]. I thought this would be a passing trend like other Zoo variants, but it's been a couple of weeks and people are still winning with it. Here's an example list I scooped off mtgonline that 4-0'd a Daily.
Why play this deck over Fast Zoo? Simple: it attacks the mana-bases of decks while being one of the fastest clocks in the format. When you realize just how weak the mana is in many decks, especially when you take into account the top deck playing Urborg and Dark Depths, then two mana Stone Rains combined with Blood Moon seem pretty sweet. Even though this deck doesn't have the same speed as normal Zoo builds, it retains all the key cards and Temporal Isolation as a bootleg Path to Exile works wonderfully.
At this point in the season, Zoo is looking to become a contender for the best deck as it did last season. Right now it's the only deck that I've seen consistently take down DDT over multiple tournaments, evolving each time to present a different approach to the problem and creating a tenuous situation for DDT players. Each iteration of the Zoo deck attacked Dark Depths in a different fashion; some did with a combination of Qasali Pridemage, Bant Charm, Meddling Mage and Negate, while others did it with pure speed backed by 8 answers to Larit Mage and sideboard Damping Matrix. Now this iteration does it with a healthy amount of mana-disruption and can board into more if necessary while still retaining the speed to beat Thopter Sword. Jonathan Loucks showed yet another variation of the Zoo deck just the other day which had Scapeshift as a way to blow through a defense and kill in a single turn.
There isn't a catch-all version to be found here that defeats the entire format with Zoo, but rather a core which can adapted and rebuilt over and over to take opponents by surprise and rework how certain matches play out. By continually changing the deck, it forces people to adapt on the fly at a given tournament and if they aren't already familiar with your particular version you can have a huge edge. Obviously playing around Blood Moon is vastly different from Tribal Flames and the same goes for Scapeshift; all require different responses.
Uninteractive Combo
This is just my base for covering decks like Hive Mind, Hypergenesis, Dredge and all of the other Combo variants that have popped up this season. Since there's at least a half-dozen of these types of Combo decks running around, I felt it would be easier to just shove them into one section. Some, like Elves, can try and interact against you more than others, but in the end all of these decks just want you dead and the onus is on the opponent to hold them down until they can win.
Really the biggest problem with this collection of decks is that it's impossible to prep for all of them. Just like last season there's no ‘Tier 1' Combo deck and instead a bunch of decks that are decent to good against Aggro and have shots against DDT. They'll lose to opponents that pack the right kind of hate or the right kind of deck (Hi Faeries!), but because they have that slot machine jackpot ability to just win the tournament without even trying these will see play.
So what can you do about it? You can play a deck naturally resistant against many strains of these Combo decks and simply board against the remaining sets. For example, DDT has a bunch of discard and counters to take on Hive Mind and Leylines post-board to make Dredge into a winnable match. While Cascade decks are significantly tougher, the addition of a single Chalice of the Void to the maindeck can make G1 winnable and post-board anymore of them can push the match further in your favor.
You get the idea.
So, are you playing Zoo without Blue? If so, congratulations, there's absolutely no way your beating all of these decks without getting incredibly lucky, so that means picking the most relevant ones. To my knowledge this is Dredge, Hypergenesis and Living End; though I admit I could be mistaken since collecting all the PTQ information to date is far more painful than it should be. In addition, this doesn't necessarily take into account that Elves grew slightly in popularity from the Grand Prix win since its total results to date.
So again, where does this leave you? It means focusing on cards that hurt Cascade decks like Ethersworn Canonist, Blood Moon or Rule of Law. Meanwhile, if you want to focus on Dredge, then Yixlid Jailer is legitimate, as well as Bojuka Bog. Unfortunately unless you run Black in your Zoo build it probably isn't worthwhile to spend the slots on having a better Dredge match. Where Canonist and Blood Moon can be good in other matches, graveyard hate is pretty craptacular unless it doubles as a way to stop the Thopter Sword Combo.
The point is that you should be aware what matches you're giving up and try to get a feel for your local metagame to at least have an educated guess if that sacrifice is worthwhile. Otherwise you should switch decks to something with a naturally better match-up against Combo in general.
If you plan on playing a Combo deck, my only suggestion is to be very well-versed in sideboarding. Just about every single person I see play a linear deck like these screws up sideboard and ends up making their deck worse in games two or three even though they supposedly have a plan against hate. If you don't know exactly why you're taking a certain card out of your deck, don't do it. Odds are good you've been over-sideboarding and making your deck's main strategy less potent the entire time and weakening your post-board games despite having ‘all these answers'. For note, if I had to pick a linear to go with for a PTQ right now, I would take Hive Mind or Hypergenesis. Both are heavily underestimated and have solid maindeckable answers to the common answer cards that see play against both of them.
Scapeshift
I keep seeing this deck in top eights, so on some level I have to assume it's good, but my personal record against the deck on MODO and testing is something ridiculous in my favor, so I find it hard to respect. That said, Rich Shay keeps telling me the UGR version is nuts with the right sideboard, so I can't really complain much. I don't know if this deck is necessarily a better choice than a normal linear strategy, but the ability to board into an entirely different plan post-board isn't to be underestimated.
Faeries (Normal and Thopter based)
I think playing Faeries right now is a losing proposition because you can't hope to beat Zoo in a million years and I just got through telling you how popular that deck is. Why can't you beat Zoo even with all the extra removal and Jitte? Think back to Faeries in Standard and how much trouble it had with Red Deck Wins. Now think of every card in that deck getting at least one mana cheaper and being more powerful in general; you'll start to figure out why Faeries just scoops game one against hands that aren't mulligans to five.
As for a good Dark Depths match, I’m not even sure if that’s true for the normal builds anymore. Fae can’t beat a resolved Thopter Foundry barring Cryptic + Counter shenanigans and it doesn’t handle eight to twelve pinpoint disruption spells very well unless you draw a bunch of Sprites. If you can keep the Sword Combo out of the way G1, then the match is probably favorable since you'll either have Extirpate or Leyline to deal with it post-board. It helps that a lot of DDT players don't actively look for a strong turn one play, which is the easiest way to beat Faeries. A turn one Dark Confidant or Thopter Foundry makes this deck take its ball and go home.
Thopter Faeries has shown to be better deck for me, cutting some crappy Faeries and irrelevant cards for more Dark Confidant and a better kill against Thopter and Zoo. Though actually playing against Zoo will still make you ask why you don’t just suck it up and play 20/20′s against them. In fact the lack of any free wins against the most popular decks or random decks is a big drawback for Faeries in general.
If you take Matej’s list and stuff in the extra two Muddles and one tutorable way to stop an opponent’s Sword Combo, then that’s pretty much the pinnacle of Fae. I still prefer running White for Path to Exile since it’s so much better against creature decks and the occasional 20/20 that just kills you. Honestly though if you max out on Smother and Deathmark, it probably is just better to stick with UB, especially with Blood Moon back in spades.
My matches with UB (and later UBw fae) were like so:
DDT: Slightly favorable, but this forced me to maindeck Extirpate
Zoo: Awful
Boros: Less awful than Zoo since Smother/Deathmark/Path and Sprite value go through the roof. Bitterblossom as a Forcefield is also legit since all their guys are basically Landfall or bust
Elves: Favorable
Scapeshift: Favorable
Cascade Decks: Smashes all of them unless they go end-step Violent Outburst, main-phase Cascade spell. Living End can win a long game by conserving Cascade spells, building mana to nullify Leak and attacking Fae’s mana. It sounds impossible for Living End, but it really isn’t.
Now saying that if you play Thopter Faeries you'll definitely lose is obviously an exaggeration and an impossible position. Somewhere, sometime, someone will take a Faeries deck and either win a PTQ or top eight a Grand Prix event or do something else to make me look awful. In expectation of this I will scale back my position to a clear rating. It's no Sealab 2021, but it isn't a 12 Oz. Mouse decision; I'd file it around Squidbillies or Superjail territory.
That's it for today, best of luck to those attending the remaining Extended events of the season. My bonus tip for the article is to play a 75 with Jace, the Mind Sculptor in it. That card is absurd and better in Extended than Standard, since you can fit it into strategies with real counters and defensive options. Plus you can actually use it to completely shut down certain Control and Combo strategies; quite the bonus if you ask me.
-Josh Silvestri
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Josh S. says: March 15, 2010 @ 8:27 pm
Just an FYI, this was written before this past weekend where Jace, the Mind Sculptor in DD was proven to be awesome and I saw the KL: GP PTQ results in regards to the Bant Foundry deck.
kyle boggemes says: March 15, 2010 @ 8:55 pm
im surprised people are still winning with the exact same list i played a month ago, too. Good article.
kevin says: March 15, 2010 @ 9:00 pm
Ive found Living Ends matchup against Fae to be not too bad. I have personally been running 3 Night of soul Betrayal’s main deck and if you resolve one Fae basically has to try to kill you with terrible mutavualts and mistbinds. Its generally easy to stick if you EoT violent and they counter the living end just to have you untap and cast NoSB.
NoSB also improves the DDT mu significantly unless they nut draw on you as well as making the boros match a wash. Ive been running simian spirit guides which can power out turn 2/3 NoSB at times.
Daniel says: March 15, 2010 @ 9:32 pm
nice AS reference, although I don’t think Squidbillies and Superjail are in the same territory.
Oh yeah, nice article too I guess. :p
Trackback MTGBattlefield says: March 15, 2010 @ 11:25 pm
Silvestri Says – Wrapping Up Extended…
Your story has been summoned to the battlefield – Trackback from MTGBattlefield…
Summa says: March 16, 2010 @ 12:03 am
I woke up this morning wanting an extended article summing up the decks and their viability. And sure enough I find this little nugget!
Chanelfireball delivers yet again!
LotusHead says: March 16, 2010 @ 3:31 am
If you wanna show up to Vintage, Josh, I got Elves built to 2 proxy (Lotus, Emerald). Just need green fetches to flesh it out.
Big Z says: March 16, 2010 @ 4:14 am
I still like Thopter Fae just like I played them at GP Oakland but I think way too many people get turned off by the atrocious game 1 against Zoo and don’t test the matchup after sideboarding. I only lost 1 game after sideboarding throughout GP Oakland and I played against 4 Zoo decks.
The boat has sailed on Extended and i don’t think thopter fae has had a fair try after GP Oakland, who knows if it would have been considered a tier 1 deck.
Dusty Fingertips says: March 16, 2010 @ 6:25 am
Superjail is just awful.
Maks says: March 16, 2010 @ 6:53 am
@ kevin “as well as making the boros [brozek?] match a wash”
you can’t expect to answer the fastest deck in the format with NoSB.
NoSB is 4 mana… Assuming a nutty draw from both of you, brozek will have you dead or well below 10 before you play it. Assuming just a nutty draw from you, you will still be within range of 4 burn spells by the time you play it, and the deck has a lot of burn spells…
Jim Varney says: March 16, 2010 @ 8:15 am
Tron is actually a decent deck if you want to crush DDT. The Zoo matchup isn’t awful like Fae’s unless they are running the Blood Moon/ Boom Bust version.
tony says: March 16, 2010 @ 9:37 am
What is your tron list and why is it does it crush ddt?
I tried making UB tron with the black splash instead of white being mostly for night of soul’s betrayal but I couldn’t find any real justification to run the tron lands and all the problems they cause, and just made a UB control deck which seems to be vastly better. NOSB is kind of the lynch pin of the deck as it has lots of synergy with vedalken shackles and sorin markov, the finisher.
Chris says: March 16, 2010 @ 9:43 am
With GP Houston and extended qualifiers still on the horizon it is nice to see that not everyone has written off extended. Nice article to read in the morning.
Josh S. says: March 16, 2010 @ 3:11 pm
Z: I mean I like your build of the deck and I’m happy to hear that it’s still working for you, because Faeries is probably my 2nd favorite deck of all time. However what you’re describing to me sounds a lot like everybody’s Dredge match-up. If the game one is horrendous and you’re favored to win g2/3, haven’t all you really done is bump your win rate up to like even-ish? Since you nearly always start a game down, they just need to get lucky once to take the match. Though maybe I’m thinking of this in the wrong way if you just straight smash them with removal.
That said I’ll definitely try it a bit more, I definitely have a couple more SB plans to try out.
Jim Varney says: March 16, 2010 @ 10:04 pm
@ Tony. You can see my Tron list in a bunch of the Extended Decks of the Week lists from about a week and a half ago.
You crush DDT for a number of reasons:
1) I play 7 maindeck outs to a 20/20, with 4 Repeal and 3 Path to Exile.
2) I run the Thopter combo as well, and I’m always going to win that battle because I have 2 to 3 times as much mana.
3) Finally, when the game stalls, which it usually does, I have inevitability with Slaver lock.
Tron plays like a Combo control deck, with two combos just like DDT. You can also still get random “I win” draws with turn 3 Sundering Titan.
Quick Chris says: March 18, 2010 @ 10:47 am
Didn’t a faeries deck win PTQ Lafayette? So Faeries can win.
Josh S. says: March 18, 2010 @ 6:04 pm
…which is what I said. Well done.